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CBS' Dennis Dodd gets a few words from Chip

  • http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/story/15253195/latest-controversy-probably-wont-affect-potent-ducks-play

    Follow me on twitter: http://twitter.com/JHopkins247

  • Regurgitating the same stories and incidents to get attention.

    Edit to add: I didn't mean you Justin, I meant the author of the story. ninja

    This post was edited by AvroDuck 3 years ago

    USC is like a german car, every piece that breaks is of the highest quality.

  • At least this story and title were simple, clear and seemed to be straight story. Most others have not been any of those things.

    Follow me on twitter: http://twitter.com/JHopkins247

  • True. And this should be our take on things, Duck fans. We are under an immense amount of scrutiny from the media and fans looking to make scapegoats out of us. Take a note from our leader. All we can do is get to work. The hands of fate will reveal our destiny. I choose to believe our staff and institution.

  • Me too. The one thing I keep going back to . . . Chip Kelly has not worked all his life to get where he is, nor has anyone else in the Athletic Department, to throw it all away and destroy what they have built by "buying" the services of Lache Seastrunk and then do it all publicly with a P.O. I just don't buy it. He knows the rules and he didn't break them.

  • Duck Nasty

    Im assuming that was a DD poser that said Oregon is in deep doo doo and knows it......

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  • The media is a blitz over this. It is a top story on most every sports sight. Unfortunately, it seems that the media plays a large role in how the NCAA pursues these stories. I have to admit, I am really worried. What we got from Lyles doesn't seem to check out for the money we paid. I think our only hope to avoid sanctions and losing coach Kelly is if he told the NCAA that we got ripped off by Lyles. If he told them anything other than that, from the beginning, I think we're in a world of hurt. The crappy thing is that we're not doing anything that any other major school isn't doing. I don't know if any of you heard Lyles' interview yesterday but he basicly said that he was steering kids away from Texas and that is why Texas hates him. By saying that he is steering kids any derection he is admitting a NCAA rule violation for any school that had their kids "steered" in their direction. We could claim that we didn't know he was steering them in our direction but the NCAA doesn't have to have proof like in a court of law. If they think we are guilty of something that is enough for them.
    I love Oregon and don't want to come across as doubting our staff but with all of the media attention and public perception that we did something wrong, I don't think it looks good.
    I think the only way out of this is if Kelly said from day one that we were ripped off by this guy and have stuck with that story.

    This post was edited by LetMeSeeYourO 3 years ago

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  • 97duck

    LetMeSeeYourO said... (original post)

    The media is a blitz over this. It is a top story on most every sports sight. Unfortunately, it seems that the media plays a large role in how the NCAA pursues these stories. I have to admit, I am really worried. What we got from Lyles doesn't seem to check out for the money we paid. I think our only hope to avoid sanctions and losing coach Kelly is if he told the NCAA that we got ripped off by Lyles. If he told them anything other than that, from the beginning, I think we're in a world of hurt. The crappy thing is that we're not doning anything that any other major school isn't doing. I don't know if any of you heard Lyles' interview yesterday but he basicly said that he was steering kids away from Texas and that is why Texas hates him. By saying that he is steering kids any derection he is admitting a NCAA rule violation for any school that had their kids "steered" in their direction. We could claim that we didn't know he was steering them in our direction but the NCAA doesn't have to have proof like in a court of law. If they think we are guilty of something that is enough for them. I love Oregon and don't want to come across as doubting our staff but with all of the media attention and public perception that we did something wrong, I don't think it looks good. I think the only way out of this is if Kelly said from day one that we were ripped off by this guy and have stuck with that story.

    hmmm. I really don't know what to think right now. One thing I keep thinking about though: If I think my children have done something wrong I ask them what happened or what did they do...It is very easy to tell if they are telling the truth or if they did something wrong just by the speed of the response and the ease of their answer. So...Oregon was speedy in it's initial response, but that response seems to be lacking quite a bit of substantive information. I'm confused about the video portion in regards to what they have, what they have/have not provided etc, and/or whether they haven't provided anything simply because the video is stored on a server they do not control and have to sign in to access and view. Should the latter be the case, then while the NCAA was on site I would imagine it would have been required that Oregon sign in and walk the NCAA through the accessible videos. I don't think anyone really knows where we stand in regards to the video portion right now. Not happy with the "paper package" though. No matter how big a fan of Oregon and our staff we all are, there really isn't any way to see it other than a little fishy. Saying we got ripped off seems to be the easy answer but I really don't think that would help in the end. Lyles actions occured during a time when there were very little repercussions to agents for wrongdoing. If he felt burned by Kelly and Oregon, there isn't very much stopping him from just coming out and saying,"yeah, in the end I steered Seastrunk, Williams, Wallace to Oregon and they paid me $25,000 for my services." Lastly, the fact that Lyles forwarded some of his player profile info as late as Feb and March just hours (in some cases) before media outlets ran with their stories regarding our ties to him looks as bad as it can get. I love our ducks, but currently hate the position we are putting ourselves in.

    No amount of deflection like: We are just getting picked on because now we are good and stealing recruits from other top programs. Or, All programs are running around doing similar things with other "street agents". Or, You don't have proof why we paid Lyles. etc. can't take away the fact that we look (as many people have plainly stated) like complete dumbasses or flat out cheaters. banghead

    This post was edited by 97duck 3 years ago

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  • Yeah, it doesn't add up. Lyles' packet was a complete joke. I don't think there is any amount of video to make up for that. There have been so many things with this that don't add up. That, and that Lyles updated his sight with current information just hours befoe yahoo broke the story on this.
    I don't think it is closed deal that we get sanctions but right now we are severely under the gun. Chip seems like such a smart guy that is always two steps ahead of everyone else, I find it hard to believe that he would do something so dumb. I'm really hoping Kelly can make sense out of all of this.
    Isn't the president of the NCAA a Husky too? I know that is a bit of a conspiracy but it makes me nervous.

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  • LetMeSeeYourO said... (original post)

    Yeah, it doesn't add up. Lyles' packet was a complete joke. I don't think there is any amount of video to make up for that. There have been so many things with this that don't add up. That, and that Lyles updated his sight with current information just hours befoe yahoo broke the story on this. I don't think it is closed deal that we get sanctions but right now we are severely under the gun. Chip seems like such a smart guy that is always two steps ahead of everyone else, I find it hard to believe that he would do something so dumb. I'm really hoping Kelly can make sense out of all of this. Isn't the president of the NCAA a Husky too? I know that is a bit of a conspiracy but it makes me nervous.

    Regarding the video portion of the package, Oregon is saying they are having trouble separating the videos Lyles provided from the videos provided by other scouting services....meaning we have now all seen the only things given to the NCAA that came from Lyles.

    The only problem with the excuse of mixed up videos is, as ESPN reported, scouting services use logos on all their videos. Even if Oregon claims Lyles didn't, the other services do, which would make it easy to determine which came from Lyles.

  • And if the video was downloaded from an online database? Then the logo should be where exactly?

    Just because we (the public and media) has not been given any video does not mean that the NCAA has not been given access to an online, password-protected database.

  • EastBayDucks said... (original post)

    And if the video was downloaded from an online database? Then the logo should be where exactly?

    Just because we (the public and media) has not been given any video does not mean that the NCAA has not been given access to an online, password-protected database.

    True. The other thing is that Will Lyles online video is not under the jurisdiction of the NCAA so they may not have the right to look at it unless some form of law said he needed to turn it over to them or if they bought it from him. How funny would that be!

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  • That may work for videos, but what about all the other info that is downloaded from a database? We have bits and pieces of information obtained through the FOIA request and lots of speculation and innuendo. What is lacking is a context. You can bet the NCAA has lots more information and the context for each of the bits and pieces of information. The media and rivals love to connect the dots that are out there, but you can bet there are many, many more that we may or may not hear about in the future.

  • 97duck

    Dude, Nasty...old regurgitated information. I can read what you just posted in about 1000 places. I'd really just like a place to discuss some of the unknowns with my fellow ducks...not a trojan!! You are not adding anything new...What are you doing here???? blah deadhorse badidea thumbdown

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  • Last time I checked there wasn't any rule against buying outdated, inaccurate information anyway. I'm not terribly concerned with what we got or didn't get. I think the main issue is whether or not there were any lies told. As long as Chip and company have been saying the same thing all along, I don't forsee more than a wrist slap. It's just like with parents. It's not always the action that gets you into trouble, it's when you lie about it. Just think if Tressel would have been forthcoming with the violations his kids made. If tOSU would have self reported and not tried co cover them up, Tressell is still the coach there.IMO

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  • LetMeSeeYourO said... (original post)

    Last time I checked there wasn't any rule against buying outdated, inaccurate information anyway. I'm not terribly concerned with what we got or didn't get. I think the main issue is whether or not there were any lies told. As long as Chip and company have been saying the same thing all along, I don't forsee more than a wrist slap. It's just like with parents. It's not always the action that gets you into trouble, it's when you lie about it. Just think if Tressel would have been forthcoming with the violations his kids made. If tOSU would have self reported and not tried co cover them up, Tressell is still the coach there.IMO

    Actually, there are NCAA rules that scouting service information must conform to, including being timely and matching what the description of the package says.

    Regarding the videos in the computer system, here is what Oregon said:

    "School officials claimed the videos are jumbled with hundreds from other sources in the football program's computer system, so they couldn't figure out which came from Lyles and which came from other sources. So they didn't produce any videos."

    So the NCAA only has the documents we've seen already.

    This post was edited by 6DyNasTy6 3 years ago

  • Really, well then, do please show where those rules are! Instead of just claiming there are such rules. Moronic supposition is still moronic!

    My bad, I promise I will quit feeding this TROLL!

    This post was edited by L Perry 3 years ago

    Probae esti in segetem sunt deteriorem datae fruges, tamen ipsae suaptae enitent

  • Justin Hopkins said... (original post)

    Really, well then, do please show where those rules are! Instead of just claiming there are such rules. Moronic supposition is still moronic!

    cheers

    There are four main bylaws that govern scouting or recruiting services: 11.3.2.5 (school personnel can't consult or endorse services), 12.3.3.1 (services can distribute student-athletes information but can't be paid a fee based on placing them at a school), 13.1.7.20 (coaches can't watch off-campus video of athletes provided by services) and 13.14.3, which is the main definition of a recruiting or scouting service.

    Oregon needs to be concerned about 12.3.3.1 and 13.14.3 (below):

    An institution may subscribe to a recruiting or scouting service involving prospective student-athletes, provided the institution does not purchase more than one annual subscription to a particular service and the service:

    (a) Is made available to all institutions desiring to subscribe and at the same fee rate for all subscribers;

    (b) Publicly identifies all applicable rates;

    (c) Disseminates information (e.g., reports, profiles) about prospective student-athletes at least four times per calendar year;

    (d) Publicly identifies the geographical scope of the service (e.g., local, regional, national) and reflects broad-based coverage of the geographical area in the information it disseminates;

    (e) Provides individual analysis beyond demographic information or rankings for each prospective student-athlete in the information it disseminates; (Revised: 4/13/10)

    (f) Provides access to samples or previews of the information it disseminates before purchase of a subscription; and

    (g) Provides video that is restricted to regularly scheduled (regular-season) high school, preparatory school or two-year college contests and for which the institution made no prior arrangements for recording. (Note: This provision is applicable only if the subscription includes video services.)

    Based on the documents turned over to the media by Oregon, Lyles' service he provided the school fails to fit (c) and (d) because he did not distribute reports at least four times per year and his geographical scope does not fit the definition of a national package. The "National" package Lyles sent was supposed to contain information on 22 states yet only contained information from five states and all but five players were from the state of Texas. A national package it was not.

    This post was edited by 6DyNasTy6 3 years ago

  • How do you know that the NCAA has only the documents we've seen already? Do you have an NCAA insider source for that info? Just because the media/public has only been given certain documents, that doesn't mean that the NCAA hasn't had access to other information that hasn't been released.

    But, whatever, you just keep on spewing your Sherlock Holmes, connect-the-dots conspiracy theories behind the comfort and safety of your computer...right along with all the other "media/news" outlets that are simply trying to sensationalize things in order to get hits to their sites.

    As for me, I'm gonna wait until the NCAA releases an "official" statement rather than listen to the nonsensical speculation and conjecture that is flying around right now. And if it so happens that they do find something incriminating, then I'll accept the punishment as deserved and move on with life.

    But, if the NCAA comes out stating that Oregon is in compliance and did not break any rules, then I challenge you 6DyNasTy6 to come back on this board and admit you were wrong all along in trying to start these fires. Where will you be then? My guess is you will slink away and hide like the slimy Trojan troll you've been thus far.

  • EastBayDucks said... (original post)

    How do you know that the NCAA has only the documents we've seen already? Do you have an NCAA insider source for that info? Just because the media/public has only been given certain documents, that doesn't mean that the NCAA hasn't had access to other information that hasn't been released.

    But, whatever, you just keep on spewing your Sherlock Holmes, connect-the-dots conspiracy theories behind the comfort and safety of your computer...right along with all the other "media/news" outlets that are simply trying to sensationalize things in order to get hits to their sites.

    As for me, I'm gonna wait until the NCAA releases an "official" statement rather than listen to the nonsensical speculation and conjecture that is flying around right now. And if it so happens that they do find something incriminating, then I'll accept the punishment as deserved and move on with life.

    But, if the NCAA comes out stating that Oregon is in compliance and did not break any rules, then I challenge you 6DyNasTy6 to come back on this board and admit you were wrong all along in trying to start these fires. Where will you be then? My guess is you will slink away and hide like the slimy Trojan troll you've been thus far.

    Well the NCAA doesn't have video because, according to UO officials:
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    "Lyles delivered some video, but said the school had difficulty retrieving the video from its computer system, or separating it from video gathered by other means."
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    And there were no other documents, according to Oregon's office of public records:
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    Elizabeth Denecke of Oregon’s office of public records explained that providing the additional information came about after a query from The Register-Guard on the initial release.

    In a subsequent telephone conversation to clarify the added release of information, Denecke said “as I understand it, it is all we have” to justify the $25,000 payment, in addition to the 143-page document titled “2011 National Package” that Lyle provided to Oregon and was released Monday. Oregon said it also received video of recruits from Lyles but couldn’t provide samples of that.
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    If Oregon is in compliance, what do I have to admit I was wrong about? I've never stated Oregon is guilty of anything. I think things seem suspicious right now, and I'm commenting on that. I've levied no accusations.

    This post was edited by 6DyNasTy6 3 years ago

  • Things seem suspicious because so little information is known at this point. How do you know that the NCAA hasn't taken a look at what might be on a coach's computer? What did Cal and LSU get?

    I just can't believe you guys are spending so much time going over the few details reported by the local and national media and playing connect-the-dots.

  • Some interesting background information on Lyles' work with Elite scouting and his transition to becoming self employed:

    Lyles worked for Elite Scouting Services in 2009. Elite founder Charles Fishbein says that he still was working there when he fired on Lyles in January 2010. In the lone public comments he's made since the story broke, Lyles told a national radio interviewer that he quit working for Elite in late 2009.

    Regardless of when or how Lyles left, the domain name for the website of his new company was not registered until March 16, 2010.

    Fishbein recently told The Oregonian he hired Lyles in 2008 to write profiles and obtain video highlight clips of high school football prospects. But by late 2009, Fishbein said, Lyles largely stopped turning in anything.

    "Every month there always was an excuse," Fishbein said.

    In January 2010, Fishbein told Lyles to go to the college coaches' convention. He didn't show. Fishbein said he learned Lyles instead had gone with Seastrunk to the Army All-America High School all-star game in San Antonio.

    "We provide information," said Fishbein, describing why he says he fired Lyles. "It's up to the coaches to recruit kids. I think Willie wanted to take shortcuts."

    About the same time, Fishbein said, Oregon coach Chip Kelly told him the Ducks no longer were going to use Elite.

    Fishbein said the conversation turned contentious after Kelly said the Ducks were dropping Elite because UO wasn't going to recruit Florida anymore.

    "I thought he was (deceiving) me," Fishbein said. "I told him, 'Whatever works for you guys.' Five minutes later I heard he's on the phone with Jerrard Randall's high school coach."

    Randall, a highly recruited quarterback from Hollywood, Fla., orally committed to Oregon but later signed a 2011 letter of intent with LSU.

    Less than three weeks after Seastrunk signed in February 2010, Lyles sent Oregon the invoice for the national package.

    http://www.oregonlive.com/ducks/index.ssf/2011/06/oregon_football_releases_recor.html

  • 6DyNasTy6 said... (original post)

    Some interesting background information on Lyles' work with Elite scouting and his transition to becoming self employed:

    Lyles worked for Elite Scouting Services in 2009. Elite founder Charles Fishbein says that he still was working there when he fired on Lyles in January 2010. In the lone public comments he's made since the story broke, Lyles told a national radio interviewer that he quit working for Elite in late 2009.

    Regardless of when or how Lyles left, the domain name for the website of his new company was not registered until March 16, 2010.

    Fishbein recently told The Oregonian he hired Lyles in 2008 to write profiles and obtain video highlight clips of high school football prospects. But by late 2009, Fishbein said, Lyles largely stopped turning in anything.

    "Every month there always was an excuse," Fishbein said.

    In January 2010, Fishbein told Lyles to go to the college coaches' convention. He didn't show. Fishbein said he learned Lyles instead had gone with Seastrunk to the Army All-America High School all-star game in San Antonio.

    "We provide information," said Fishbein, describing why he says he fired Lyles. "It's up to the coaches to recruit kids. I think Willie wanted to take shortcuts."

    About the same time, Fishbein said, Oregon coach Chip Kelly told him the Ducks no longer were going to use Elite.

    Fishbein said the conversation turned contentious after Kelly said the Ducks were dropping Elite because UO wasn't going to recruit Florida anymore.

    "I thought he was (deceiving) me," Fishbein said. "I told him, 'Whatever works for you guys.' Five minutes later I heard he's on the phone with Jerrard Randall's high school coach."

    Randall, a highly recruited quarterback from Hollywood, Fla., orally committed to Oregon but later signed a 2011 letter of intent with LSU.

    Less than three weeks after Seastrunk signed in February 2010, Lyles sent Oregon the invoice for the national package.

    http://www.oregonlive.com/ducks/index.ssf/2011/06/oregon_football_releases_recor.html

    You must be having a bad day! You've been posting a lot on a Duck board today. You need a hug? I won't give you one but I'm sure somebody will!

  • He is seriously obsessed with this story . . . along with a ton of other Trojans. I laugh that he keeps posting stuff from the Oregonian as if we haven't seen it. But, just in case, the Trojans are posting these articles everywhere I look.

  • billm said... (original post)

    He is seriously obsessed with this story . . . along with a ton of other Trojans. I laugh that he keeps posting stuff from the Oregonian as if we haven't seen it. But, just in case, the Trojans are posting these articles everywhere I look.

    Maybe it's a group of them designed to bring down the system by causing us to implode!

  • It must make them feel good to play connect-the-dot with some cherry-picked information so that they can make us dirtier than they ever were. Dude's obsessed with us.